TRANSCRIPT ~ EPISODE 23

EPISODE 23: Our mentors, ourselves, with Aja Fenn

Producer/Host: Liz Sabatiuk | Music: "Duo de Amor" written by Astor Piazzolla, performed by Tango Bardo | Image Credit: Maurice Kaplan

AJA:
A good friend of mine at the time in London, he reached out to me one evening and said, "Hey, I just got a movie from the foreign language section of the library. It's called The Tango Lesson.

LIZ: Sally Potter's...

AJA: Yeah, Sally Potter's movie with Pablo Verón. And he said, "Do you want to come over and watch it with me?" That was the first time I'd seen tango or heard the music. I think the first thing I was drawn to was just how beautiful the movement was and how sort of sophisticated it was. I could see that it was a dance of masculine and feminine energy, and I think I just thought it was so beautiful to see that interaction. So then my friend - Moe, his name was - said, you know, "We should go to a tango lesson in London." And I was like, "I'm down." So we went to a tango lesson and he never took another one, and I knew, I knew within about 20 minutes into the lesson that I was gonna dedicate myself to it.

[MUSIC]

LIZ ID INTRO:
I'm Liz Sabatiuk and this is Humans of Tango, where we explore what tango has to teach through the experiences of those who dance it.

LIZ SCRIPT:
That was Aja Fenn - a London-born, Washington, D.C.-based tango professional whose intuition in that very first tango class
was the start of a journey that's lasted 24 years and counting. I feel very blessed to consider Aja both a mentor and a friend.
One of many things I appreciate about her is how she fearlessly pursues what inspires her - in this case, the dance she experienced in that first lesson, which soon had her crossing the Atlantic and the equator to tango's epicenter in Buenos Aires.

AJA:
I right away knew I was going to Buenos Aires and I started saving up money for that trip. And then I went to Buenos Aires, planning to just go for a couple of weeks, as you do. I ended up staying for about a year and a half and then just sort of dedicated myself there full-time to dancing every minute that I could. And then I found my teacher Matías Facio. He was a very important early teacher for me. Honestly, I feel like Matías really taught me how to dance, actually. Everything he taught me was just true and solid and universal and kind of, uh, timeless - you know, stands the test of time - and just a great foundation. And I also, I think I discovered working with Matías intensively that there's real value sometimes to working with one teacher for a while, kind of committing to their method for long enough to really get a chance to know that method and to embody it and decide whether or not you want to go any further with it or start exploring other methods and techniques and styles. And prior to meeting Matías, I'd just been kind of going here, there and everywhere and, and that can be confusing for a new dancer.

I was also dealing with some health challenges, which sort of manifested as difficulty with hearing and speaking. So being there just filled me with so much joy that it was really like a refuge for me as well during what was really a challenging time for me physically.

And then I met my ex-husband. We spent time there together in Buenos Aires training. He was from Ecuador, but he also had sort of Argentine family. Because he spoke perfect Spanish, I think he was in some ways more deeply connected to what was going on than I was. I was learning Spanish - you know, slowly picking it up - but I would miss things because of the language barrier. And so he was able to kind of fill me in on really important things that I should have known about. Like, I remember he took me to Tete's class.

[LIZ ASIDE] More about Tete in the show notes.

AJA: And he kept telling me how important this teacher was. And I didn't, honestly didn't see what all the fuss was about [LAUGHTER] because, you know, when you're sort of a young student and you're new, you don't yet value the spirit and the culture and the wisdom of the elders, I suppose. But he did! He'd been dancing longer than me, but he somehow got that, you know, and was able to help transmit some of that to me. So I thank Pablo for that. Otherwise, I wouldn't have even been aware that I was in Tete's class.

Yeah, well, he eventually left Buenos Aires and went back to the States. He was finishing his studies in law and then he got a job and he encouraged me to come and be in the States with him, so that's why I eventually left Buenos Aires. And that's when I started learning to lead. Actually, Pablo was really my first- Pablo, my ex-husband, was my first leading teacher - and he was very generous with me.

I started forming practice partnerships with other women. Um, Mitra Martin was one of them.

[LIZ ASIDE] co-founder of Oxygen Tango in Los Angeles

AJA: And what I loved about practicing with Mitra is she was just like me - she was super serious about it. Like, when we met, we weren't there to mess around. We were really there to work and we had a lot of fun together.

LIZ: Were you starting to make your living from tango at that time already?

AJA: Yeah, so when I moved to the States, I, I did start teaching. And initially, Pablo and I were teaching together. And then he sort of became very busy with his work and I started doing more teaching on my own. And then he and I went our separate ways at one stage. It was a heartbreaking time. And so I decided, my father invited me to, um, come stay with him for a few months in Australia. And I actually, there was a bit of a kind of painful association with tango because I linked it so strongly to Pablo that I, I also wanted a break from tango.

Something else that I was doing once I moved to the States was I started training to become a fertility awareness method coach. It's an amazing life tool and it's an amazing embodiment practice that I think has, you know, informed all the other embodiment practices I've done, including tango. And so I went to Australia for three months to kinda' get away from tango for a while and to really throw myself, like, deeply into this, getting, like, fully certified and authorized to teach the method. And, um, when I got there, I did start that process, but it kind of felt like...kind of a little bit like a struggle. I was doing it and it was happening, but it- there was something about it that felt like I was kind of swimming a little bit upstream against- you know, like, it took a lot of effort.

And then when I was there, just out of the blue, I decided to go to a milonga. My dad lives in this little beach town called Byron Bay, where there's really, you know, not a huge tango scene. [LAUGHING] At the time, there was barely anything happening there, but there was something, you know, and I, I decided to show up. And it just so happened that that day there was a teacher in town, Damien Thompson. He was probably, he's a very good dancer and a very good teacher, Damien. And he just happened to be there that day. And suddenly, and that was,

LIZ: Oh, all of a sudden the current started moving again.

AJA: And it's so funny, 'cause I really thought that going all the way to Australia would keep me safe from tango. You know, that like, if I went to Byron Bay, the most remote part, easterly point of Australia, where there's no tango, I can throw myself into the fertility awareness work. Well, that was it, you know, one side step and we were working together.

[MUSIC]

And then that was it for a few years. I mean, I did continue doing the women's work - it'll always be in my heart - but it wasn't- at the, at the time I was supposed to be doing tango, you know, and there was nowhere to run. Like, I tried- I kind of went as far away from it as I could, but it found me, you know, it found me and got hold of me, and that was it. And that was just like- and it was so easy. It was like slipping into this groove that just took off by itself, you know, 'cause it was, it was sort of aligned with, like, my heart, really.

And so then I just spent the next few years being a traveling tango teacher and I sort of didn't really know beyond the next two or three gigs what was next, but something always came along and filled the space. And there were various different partners, but they were, like, probably the- my most important teachers in some ways. They helped me with my following, I learned a lot about leading from them, and I learned a lot about teaching from them. And I'm sure and I hope they learned from me too, along the way.

And then I discovered Sharna.

[LIZ ASIDE] That's Sharna Fabiano, the fabulous tango human who first connected me with Aja as practice partners and who has since created a book and a podcast dedicated to exploring dynamics of lead and follow - linked in the show notes, of course.

AJA: I was actually teaching in Washington, DC, teaching some workshops and performing. And I think I met her at Eastern Market 'cause I performed there that night. And that was the first time I met her in person, but I knew all about her. I think I slightly overwhelmed her with my enthusiasm about it, because it's the first time she'd met me or ever heard of me and there I was, you know, I'd been following her and kind of worshiping her for years from a distance. There was little bits of little snippets of footage of her on the internet leading. And while I was learning to lead, I just found women like her and Brigitta Winkler and Rebecca Shulman so inspiring. Also Valeria Solomonoff.

[LIZ ASIDE] All members of TangoMujer, an all-women dance troupe that performed between 1996 and 2006.

AJA: I just, I remember watching her dance as a leader and just being so blown away by just how proficient she was and how she embodied the leading role.

LIZ: Is that going back to the masculine feminine?

AJA: Yes, yes, she totally stepped into that, fully. Unapologetically. And when I met her, I basically just said, "Sharna, I just want to be near you. Can I just be here and be around you in whatever capacity you'll tolerate me? Like, I just want to kind of dance with you if I get that opportunity, I want to learn from you. I want to observe you teach. I want to just be near you."

And she was kind of like, "Oh!" [LAUGHTER]

LIZ: You said that the first night that you met her?

AJA: I think within minutes of meeting her, actually. Pretty much.

LIZ: And she was like, "Am I flattered or scared?" [LAUGHTER]

AJA: "-or disturbed." No, she was very gracious about it. And she said, "Well, you know, maybe, let's see. You know, let's get together." And Sharna was kind enough to invite me to do a teaching residency for Tango Mercurio. It was a nonprofit that she created in D.C., and that was a sort of apprenticeship period. And she became a very important mentor for me because she was the first single woman, even though she did work with guys, she mostly or at least a lot of the time taught by herself and had built a school, you know, as a single woman tango dancer and teacher. She, she was a very proficient leader and a really excellent teacher.

I think one of the things I discovered working with Sharna was that my inner feminine gifts were so highly developed. My gifts of receptivity, sort of sensitivity, a natural inclination to support the vision of another, these were all so fully awakened and online for me. But what I discovered through working with her was underdeveloped was actually a lot of my masculine gifts of assertiveness, decisiveness. Like, for me, it was actually pretty uncomfortable for a long time stepping into a role of directing another person. When I started to see what a gift that it was for my partner and how it freed them to relinquish those responsibilities and drop fully into their role, that's when I- the discomfort started to fall away. When I started to really understand what a gift it could be. So that was sort of my process with awakening that side of myself as a dancer and a person, you know? It carried over into my life more as well.

LIZ SCRIPT:
As you've probably gathered, Aja doesn't subscribe to the convention in mainstream tango of designating the roles according to gender. But she does find the concepts of masculine and feminine useful to describe certain energy and qualities - in life and in tango.

AJA:
You know, the symbol of yin yang, which people use a lot when they talk about tango. It's quite a common metaphor. The idea that there are two kind of polarized primordial energies that are, you could say opposite, but inherent in each one is a little bit of the other. And I think that's a really useful metaphor and I know a lot of other people do, which is why so many of us use it when we talk about tango, because tango, interestingly, it does not work at all when it's completely polarized. That's one of the things that's so fascinating about the exchange of masculine, feminine energy in tango is that if someone is 100% in their masculine and the other is 100% kind of embodying the feminine yin principle, then it's not tango, because the inherent in the leading role is some feminine energy of, you know, being sensitive to your partner, being able to track and tune into their responses, just to name a few.

And then being in the following role also requires certain yang or masculine qualities, such as taking action and making decisions about what kind of action you're going to take. If we go back to that idea of the yin yang symbol, those two dots that are in each, each role, you can play around with the size of that dot and you can make it really big.

LIZ: And is that where you get into more of a Queer Tango space?

AJA: Yeah - I mean, certainly. And I remember I've, you know, when I was in Berlin under Brigitta's mentorship

[LIZ ASIDE] That's Brigitta Winkler, a pioneer of the European Tango Renaissance and co founder of TangoMujer.

AJA: I practiced with somebody she recommended I practice with. Her name was Nancy.

[LIZ ASIDE]That's Nancy Lavoie, a tango teacher currently based in Montreal, Canada.

AJA: Wonderful person and dancer. And I only had the great privilege of practicing with her that one time, but at the time, she was a much more skilled dancer than me - much more skilled leader, I should say. You know, my leading was still catching up with my following. She was really good at both roles - really well-rounded dancer and practicing with her was the first time I really experienced the magic of those realms of playing with the size of that, that dot.

It's difficult to explain because it's experiential, you know, and it does become a little mystical and nonlinear. But I experienced that with her where it was really fluid, the moving in and out of each role became very fluid and almost like constant, and just took over both of us. Like, really quite transcendent, actually - very extraordinary experience practicing with that person - Nancy was her name. And she probably has no idea what an impact maybe, maybe I'll try and send her this.

Yeah, and I could barely keep up because her level was higher, and she was very generous and gracious with me and raised me up, of course, as higher level dancers are able to do. But we went into realms where who the hell was leading and following anymore, nobody knew. It was like witnessing art, rather than creating it - it just flowed through us both. [LAUGHS] I don't know whether her experience was remotely as profound as mine, probably not. But that was when I knew that absolutely that kind of- that exchange of masculine feminine energy can be played with in all sorts of ways in tango.

I think if I'm really, really honest with you, I don't know that that's my favorite version of tango relationship. I think my personal favorite version of tango is one that's more like that original yin yang symbol, where there is polarity, but there is, of course, something of the other role. I think that's my personal favorite place to go with tango and my personal favorite way to dance and relate, whether halfway through the song, I switch off with my partner or whether I stay in the same role throughout. And I also think what you choose to drop into can invite your partner into its sort of counter role as well.

For me, the feminine role - none of these words are ideal but we'll just use that so we can talk about it.

LIZ: [LAUGHS] You like feminine better than following?

AJA: Well, it's tricky because following also limits it to following, doesn't it? Whereas the feminine following yin role, you can also direct the dance to some degree. And like we just talked about, you can make that portion very small or you can make it much bigger if you have a partner who's on the same page as you for that. But yeah. I think for me, what feels like home is when I'm in a predominantly feminine role. Yeah. It's sort of interesting because when my partner sort of totally takes on certain responsibilities in the dance, like deciding on the unfolding choreography of the dance, I'm sort of freed to be fully expressive. And then of course my expression can influence their direction. So that's where it becomes, yeah, sort of a cyclical thing.

[MUSIC]

AJA:
So when I started tango, it was the year 2000 - I was in Buenos Aires in the year 2000 - and there was a transition happening. This new era was coming about, that was the tango nuevo era.

[LIZ ASIDE] Check the show notes if you'd like to nerd out about the term "tango nuevo."

And it was becoming a lot more relaxed, the way people moved, the way they dressed, people were starting to dance to alternative music. And when you watched performances, it was a lot more relaxed. Yeah. Yeah. By the way I have the utmost respect for stage tango. It's an incredible amount of work that goes into that kind of skill. But what I'm saying is that during my time, you know - and I spent years training with Nuevo style teachers and dancers, so that was really my era for a long time - during my time, amongst the good social dancers, the only performances worth seeing were the ones happening at milongas. And the only ones happening at milongas were always improvised. And what you were watching was the depths that a couple can go to in an improvised, lead-follow relationship. That was what was so fascinating and impressive about it. And that's what they were showing. Whereas now I think because there's pressure on dancers to have such a clean, polished, perfect performance, I think a lot of dancers feel that they need to have certain sequences or combinations, like, well-prepared and well-polished so they can just sort of knock them out when they want to. So... So you don't see that element of risk anymore. There used to be, like, risk in performances and that was where so much of the magic happened.

But I mean, choreography- when Masha and I danced in Philadelphia, we did a choreography.

[LIZ ASIDE] Referring to Masha Abapolnikova, Aja's dear friend and partner in all sorts of tango-related activities.

Creating choreography can be an incredibly fun creative process as well. To actually... It can be really satisfying to actually get the whole thing to be good rather than, you know, with an improvised performance, you never bloody know what's going to happen.

Yeah. It's nice to also work on the aesthetic too, to make something look really nice and clean. I mean, that's one of the nice things as well about the way it's evolved because when you do look back on the Nuevo era, in some ways, it could be a bit too relaxed sometimes. It was just a different thing. Yeah. There wasn't really much emphasis on the beauty of the movement. I think it, it was more about the possibilities and the fun. And I notice nowadays when I see performances, it's very refined and the dancers are really skilled in terms of like the control they have over their body and their movement. And in a way that that's what's being shown and emphasized rather than I think back then what was being shown was the creativity and the fun. Like, the Nuevo movement was so much fun, actually - it was all about, like, exploration. And now it's about perfection.

I feel like nowadays the level of physical skill and self-control required to dance at a high level of tango is a much higher bar than it used to be. I suppose I'm talking about performances, but like you said, it carries over into the milongas. What people are watching is what's inspiring them. And for me, like as my body's getting a little older, it doesn't feel as attainable for me now, you know, to do some of that stuff that I'm seeing. Or it can be done, but it's a lot of work. It's a lot of work and requires a lot of training and commitment to it. And when something's that much work, it can cross over into pain, physically painful, putting those kinds of demands on your body. It's not for everybody. It's like that can become a distraction from the actual joy of the conversation of tango with a partner.

[MUSIC]

LIZ SCRIPT:
Shifting from performance to social dance, Aja practices a philosophy to protect her body and nurture that joy of the conversation she just mentioned. Where many of us, myself included, sometimes dance with a partner out of a sense of politeness or even obligation, Aja is careful to dance only when she truly wants to.

AJA:
When somebody's working full-time in tango and they depend on teaching you know they make their living that way first of all they're one injury away from unemployment they have to conserve in order to take care of their bodies so I think that you know often teachers will be kind of there's a lot of people disappointed in teachers and the teachers are aware of that energy coming at them you know because everyone wants to dance with yeah because everybody wants to dance with them and it is a way that the dance is transmitted as well it is it is one thing's for sure really the only thing we have to offer people is the vibrations we're holding and if I'm dancing with someone and I don't want to be i'm really not offering them anything at all if if I'm polarized inside myself about that action it's not aligned with love or truth and it's therefore not really an offering to anyone or to life. And so I'm very careful to make sure that when i dance with somebody that i want to. Because i feel like that's the only time it's a form of giving. Otherwise it's a form of approval-seeking, which is not really useful for anything or anyone. And so I definitely make a practice of asking myself if I want to. And I often do want to dance with people that are a much quote-unquote lower level than I am, because it's aligned with love and genuine generosity in that moment. You know, I want to support them. I want to give them that opportunity. I want to invest in them - there's a little bit of a selfish part- angle in there, you know, that one day it'll come back to me. 

LIZ: And you've had that experience-

AJA: Oh, I have-

LIZ: -you've trained people who are amazing dancers.

AJA: Yes, for sure, for sure-  and and it does it does come back what you give out. And you know I'm aware that I've got to really take care of my body, so sometimes I might want to be able to dance with more people than would be a good idea in terms of taking care of myself.

It's also nice you know for teachers to just, when they're out at a milonga, especially if it's not their own milonga, to not be working - to just be there for themselves for a couple hours and dance with someone they want to dance with for their own pleasure. Because being a tango teacher is a lot of output, you know? You're you're dancing with people to help them with their dancing all the time and so sometimes it's nice to just dance just for yourself.

LIZ SCRIPT:
In recent years, Aja has been finding a lot of joy and inspiration in the process of sharing tango with others as a teacher and a mentor.

AJA:
I definitely believe that teaching is an art form in its own right and that a person can be either passionate about that art form or not so passionate about it. I am passionate about the art form of teaching. It's, up until this point I'd say the deepest focus has been on being the best teacher I can be. I think one of the most important ways to bring that into being is wanting that. One has to intend to be a good teacher and for whatever's in the way of being a good teacher, be ready for that to surface and then process it. Brigitta really taught me actually about the kind of power of, she calls it teaching from the back of the room. Like, getting out of the way and really making it about them, and ever since then I've really gone deeper and deeper, like, personally into my own intention to be in service to my students and just kind of carefully tracking my own ego in that process. Always before every single class I remind myself why I'm there and I ask for help to be the clearest instrument that I can be for whatever knowledge or wisdom may have been accumulated here in my own tango path.

For a long time I think when we're new at anything there is this feeling of, um, "Am I good enough?" And the need to prove that we're good enough. And so one of the things that used to happen to me in the earlier years of teaching tango was you know if people would show up to my classes that were quite proficient at tango, I would end up making the material too difficult, and that was my way of overcompensating for a feeling of insecurity or inadequacy. And in a way I think that's one of the nice things about having come this far in my journey. I feel like I've arrived at a place now where I actually don't need to prove myself in that kind of way anymore, and actually I feel like I- like I'm finally able to make it about them, [LAUGHS] and, and whatever serves them. And because that's now so deeply my orientation, I'm able to find what that is very often. And it's just delightful - it's a delightful relief to have arrived at that place.

I've been, um, I've been exploring offering myself as a guide for people interested in teaching tango, and, um, really just offering the benefit of all the mistakes I've made - because I've made so many and I feel like I've really harvested the learning from those mistakes. And so it's, it's really fun to kind of offer people shortcuts and share how not to do things, at least from my perspective. I did the first teacher training when I was with Tango Mercurio, and then I just recently did two more.

[LIZ ASIDE] through Fabrica Tango, a school Aja co-founded with Masha.

And I really enjoyed it. You know how we were talking about you know performing as one art form teaching is another art form dancing is another art form. I feel like I've now entered a whole new space, a whole new area of development for me, which is guiding the guiders. It's stepping into a role of mentorship, which has been terrifying and filled with imposter syndrome, and- but that's, you know, part of the journey, I think, of, of that it's part of the rite of passage. And I've, I've once or twice leaned into some of my mentors about it and they've been very encouraging, you know, reminding me that iI am ready and that we never feel ready. And, and through doing it, I've discovered actually how much use I can be to people in that regard. Just like I was saying that stepping into the leading role in the dance is a gift to the followers, you know, it's been important for me to take that seat in a way that's, like, stepping in fully. To not hold back and not be shy about it and, and to really share what I've discovered.

And so that's been just amazing like a whole new area of learning and growth and opening. And of course whatever you teach you get better at. If you teach tango you get better at tango. If you teach teaching you get better at teaching. So it's helping me develop as a teacher as well. So one of the things we've been doing is we've been holding free beginner classes for people to come and be experimented on. [LAUGHS] And that's been just a deeply fascinating process and also it's just such a joy to see how people bring their own personal medicine and flavor to it. Every single person has their own offering that's so unique to them and is all about their life experience and their gifts. So it's just wonderful to watch that emerge from people, especially when you've known people in a totally different context, as either your student or a fellow dancer, to then see them in a completely different role and to see what they bring to it and then to reflect it back to them, to reflect to them their strengths and talents, it's a real privilege. To be able to tell them, you know, what they're so good at and what they're doing well. And that's one of the things I've actually kind of focused on a lot in the teacher training is, rather than critiquing people, I've been making it a lot about drawing on people's strengths and just noticing how as teacher trainees, that support, like, a space where their nervous system can relax and they can feel safe to make mistakes, just allows for them to, like, really blossom. So that's been a very interesting part of the teacher training journey is discovering the the power of pointing out people's strengths rather than their mistakes and working in, like, pointing out mistakes but working it in to the curriculum rather than pointing it out to them directly or in front of their peers.

So it's been a very- I've been enjoying it and really inspired by it and honored- it's such an honor, it's such an honor, and it's such a responsibility as well. Stepping into the role of a mentor, you have to keep bringing yourself back to the humility to be in service, get out of the way, and really make it about them. And just be be honored by the privilege, really, to have people placed in your care by life.

LIZ SCRIPT:
Here's to appreciating the inspiration, generosity, and wisdom life brings our way - and to cultivating inspiration, generosity, and wisdom in ourselves in the process. Huge and infinite thanks to Aja, and thanks to Tango Bardo whose recording of "Duo de Amor" by Astor Piazzolla is featured in this episode.

[MUSIC]